joining me now is michelle, former under secretary of defense, cofounder for the center of new american security. this is a major statement by the new leader. he's, obviously, trying to shore up his own reputation internally, but it is -- is it without consequences? nothing we can do, given china's continuing support, condemnation, but continuing support for pyongyang. >> it's clearly a provocation, it's clearly a violation of the u.n. security council resolutions against north korea. it is important china did come out and condemn this. north korea probably listens to china more than anybody else, but i do think the international community needs to make good on the consequences. >> what's the concern now, they have a nuclear test, they have a real delivery system? >> it's still many years to get, or at least some years, to get a ballistics capability to threaten us, but these things tend to come in cycles, and so it's not a good sign that they are starting down the provocation road again. >> given how heavily sanctioned they are, why are they doing this? >> this is really about shoring